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Substance use and addiction

Discussion in 'General Substance Abuse Discussion' started by ryanwil, Sep 22, 2019.

  1. ryanwil

    ryanwil Member

    Hi, I am looking for some advice. I am looking for a rehab center for my brother. He has been using some drugs and now he is at a stage where he can't quit. Can someone suggest a good rehab center in the Toronto region?
    I found one in Aurora called Freedom from Addiction. If anyone knows about this rehab, please let me know about that as well. Thanks in advance.
  2. DoxyMom

    DoxyMom Community Champion

    @ryanwil hello. Sorry I can't help with that but there is a phone number on this site and they can. Good luck.
  3. Bullwinkle

    Bullwinkle Community Champion

    I’ve helped others by suggesting they call Alcoholics Anonymous or sometimes an intervention helps. However, usually no one wants help unless they reach their bottom, e.g. the drowning reaching for a life jacket.

    Addiction is the symptom of one or more mental disorders and is the cure for that of which purports to be the disease. Addiction is a delivery system to reaching their bottom of reality, because the purpose for addiction is recovery.

    Addiction isn’t a disease, it causes disease. Smoking tobacco, the 1# killer, and alcohol the #2 killer are prime examples of that which causes disease. The AMA and other medical associations claim addiction is a disease, based on how lucrative it is, following the money trail usually reveals the truth. No one I’ve known gets sober until they reach their bottom and attending rehab rarely accomplishes this. But, as I shared, addiction is the delivery system for the addict to reach their bottom.

    Most rehabs use the Alcoholics Anonymous 12 Step Model, which deals with the problem, not the symptom. Post treatment, rehab suggests their clients attend AA, NA etc. In other words, 1000’s of dollars is spent for recovery when AA, NA etc. is free for the same recovery model.

    The problem with rehabs is the revolving door syndrome of relapse. This occurs when the addict struggles with remaining sober after completing treatment. Individuals who experience this syndrome are likely to complete treatment, relapse, and then enter another treatment program. This frequently occurs, because the rehab is safe, but it’s not the real world.
    True concern and Onceaddicted77 like this.
  4. True concern

    True concern Moderator

    The best claim against addiction being a disease I have ever heard,read,or seen(Two of those are the same but whatever)and I have to agree with you at this time.If we allow them to convince us it's a "Disease" we are more likely to accept addiction as a never ending,constantly evolving,unavoidable deterioration of our own self being,the disease is mental health(If were still looking to label the affliction a disease)mental health and various disorders require certain medications and so we self medicate with this or that to tame the disorder temporarily as it becomes what our lives revolve around until death.I am starting to understand I have been fighting the common sense side of this problem(Science or Religion?)I can learn and come to terms with the science and educational route to understanding how to change this and for the longest time I've ignored it in fear of upsetting my creator,it's only after reading your post a little more makes sense,as if staying trapped in addiction doesn't upset my creator...how could I have been so damn blind?If I can use the knowledge of the modern world to break free,why wouldn't i?It will get me sober and my creator won't have to be upset with me for allowing a substance to chain down my free will!I will forever remain loyal to God but I suppose that doesn't mean I can't educate myself in New ways as well.Eye Opening Post @Bullwinkle thank you for typing this down in a way that painted the correct picture,at least for myself
  5. Onceaddicted77

    Onceaddicted77 Spam fighting Moderator & Realist Community Listener

    I have to agree it makes alot of sense dosnt it. You get trapped in a never ending cycle of addiction then recovery then addiction then recovery and calling it a disease is a justification.

    When really all we have to do first is obviously want freedom from the chains of these drugs normally Rock bottom when the negatives have finally outweighed the positive effects you get.

    Second is educate ourselves in however you must to understand why we want the drugs. Which has alot to do with the imbalances in our neurons. Mental disorders.

    3rd How do we maintain freedom.

    Very thought provoking post @Bullwinkle thanks
    Joshstillclean and True concern like this.
  6. Onceaddicted77

    Onceaddicted77 Spam fighting Moderator & Realist Community Listener

    What is sober though. Is someone who drinks 10 cups of coffee a day sober? What constitutes sober. Harm reduction medicine?
    Idk anymore.

    What about abstinence from the drug you had a problem with and dont feel that other drugs are a problem. Is that sober? I honestly dont know anymore.
    Joshstillclean and True concern like this.
  7. True concern

    True concern Moderator

    There is no such thing as "Sober"I mean 90% of the globe must have that Facebook fix as soon as their eyes open.I don't know what Sober means anymore either my friend even when I drop the vices that confine me I have to pick up new ones to replace the old one's
  8. Onceaddicted77

    Onceaddicted77 Spam fighting Moderator & Realist Community Listener

    I agree brother I think the words Addiction recovery and sobriety are just words used to condition us.
    Joshstillclean likes this.
  9. True concern

    True concern Moderator

    Labels to make us subconsciously accept the situation as a social status standard,to separate the cows from the bulls,to tranquilizer our instinct to fight for something more,something better,something without a label called PEACE
  10. Onceaddicted77

    Onceaddicted77 Spam fighting Moderator & Realist Community Listener

    Yes because the only thing that matters on this earth is our spirit with god and our happiness.

    Excatly Labels are man made and meant to break our spirit.

    Science will tell us how to fix our body and god will tell us how to fix our spirit. Nothing else matters not the car you drive or the house you live in. People matter on this planet material things ain't worth ****.
    Joshstillclean and True concern like this.
  11. True concern

    True concern Moderator

    Our thoughts are very similar if you get to the core,beyond the superficial everyday robotic word's of conversation and you said you weren't good at putting your feelings out there,I wasn't either brother when I first got here now I can type emotion like I'm Buddha's first born LMAO
  12. Onceaddicted77

    Onceaddicted77 Spam fighting Moderator & Realist Community Listener

    Haha man I so wish I could just open all up and pour it out but I hold back so much I dont know why. I've never been able to and I really started working on that when I decided to stop suboxone I told myself I really want to change my ways. My wife tells me all the time I'm a robot sometimes I feel like I am too. It feels like i should have more empathy towards things and that's really why I came here to try to see if I could really open up. I figured it would be easier with people I dont know and it is but its definitely a process.

    It feels like I have no emotions sometimes I just try to have logical thinking but I really feel that iam missing out on a good part in life I want to feel like I'm alive again and I have to admit I did when I was withdrawing and I miss those feelings.
    True concern likes this.
  13. True concern

    True concern Moderator

    Your doing a great job bro,in the beginning, like a month after I got here I just started being that person every addict needs,the one that can take you from feeling pity to feeling hope and I did it well,I enjoyed helping other's...still do but I'm stuck in a shame bubble and I'm having a hard time getting out because everyone has seen me at my peak of heartfelt wholsomness and now my post read like a crazy,half nuts lunatic so I fear I can never fully repair the image I first set,it's like I set the bar to high to ever reach again.Its self pity,self doubt bullshit and I'm growing tired of it myself however I promised to document my struggle here on this site way back so other's can see a person can go from low to high to low again but now that I have displayed that (Which is meant to be a caution)to people fresh in recovery i can feel it in my heart and soul im ready to pull out of this funk and show a truly loving heart again, I just dont know if others will be by myside as i pick myself up again. Pathetic is how this reads to myself but again thats that defeatist bullshit trying to convince me it cant be done but deep down i know better
    Onceaddicted77 likes this.
  14. Bullwinkle

    Bullwinkle Community Champion

    Sober for me is soundness of mind, to be logical or realistic about life. Behavior that is injurious to others and self, isn’t sober.

    David Stewart said, “Few people realize that sobriety is an action of insights and skills far beyond mere abstinence. Sobriety is a creative discipline in the art of freedom of growth and of love. To be yourself is to become yourself”.

    I know many addicts that freed themselves from their drug of choice, but smoke cannabis without addiction.
  15. Joshstillclean

    Joshstillclean Stupidity Exists - Fact.

    That's a quote to go in the record books right there my friend. The words you ended with are what we all need to focus on.
    And sobriety is yet another label I think if you really want to get deep into it. Just my opinion...but I think if one goes by someone else's standards them,the are never truly sober.
    One person may think this is sober and like your coffee example another may not think this persons actions are the actions of a sober mind.
    What is sober to you-using common sense and morals people seem to have forgotten.
    To me, this is sober.
    Yes very thought provoking.
    Gotta say I don't miss sub detox at all-but I did feel, and that made me feel sober.
    But I wasn't sober-so its a never ending cycle. Unless we take ourselves out of the box that modern society has created for us.
    If we do that then I think we can all achieve sobriety(but isn't that term just a word invented for meaning someone else's variable like sober equals x)...
    So yeah, I think what is sober to one might be different for another. We don't all fit in the same box the world wants us to fit in.
    And so many people are medicated to fit into this box when in reality that is just who they are. How they were meant to be.
    Just my opinion.
    True concern and Onceaddicted77 like this.
  16. Bullwinkle

    Bullwinkle Community Champion

    I appreciate your sentiment, well said! I’ll write more later, when I have time!

    For me, there is a clear separation between abstinence and sobriety. I define abstinence simply as free from symptomatic addiction. Just being abstinence eliminates the symptom, but doesn’t address behaviors, emotions, mental health, etc. that engenders addiction. It just means that the addicted are physically free of drugs/alcohol dependency. Sobriety includes abstinence, but also encompasses much more than just stopping drinking or abusing drugs. Abstinence is just the bare minimum solution.

    Language evolves, so, words only have meaning based on the value cultures / tribes assign, it’s neurolinguistics. In my day, during WWll, Geek was derogatory, today it’s positive e.g. Best Buy’s Geek Squad. Thus, with neurolinguistics generally the brain reacts positive to geek. Punk was almost as bad as Fvck, because a punk was a man that got raped in jail or prison. Today punk can still be derogatory, but not in the same context as it was in prison, or e.g. punk rock.

    When I grew-up in the USA, I didn’t describe people that came from African slavery as Black, this was negative, colored or negro was the accepted description. In Spanish negro means black. Today it’s African American, Black or "people of color", which is a non-white category.
    Last edited: Sep 27, 2019
  17. True concern

    True concern Moderator

    I WROTE THIS WAY BACK ON A BLOG I HAD I WILL SHARE IT HERE FOR NOW.

    SATURDAY, JULY 7, 2018
    Confusing Emotional state of mind

    I suffer from endless nightmares,to the point i try not to sleep and when i do accidentally node off it's less than 1 hour and i jump up looking for various family members,i dream of my wife quite a bit and I remember hearing her warning about 2 year's before she kicked me out,she warned me time and time again that one day she would be over it and instead of listening i was just hearing her word's,never thought i would lose her even with the warnings.The entire time i abused drug's and alcohol i hated it,every bit of it.She heard me and watched me fight addiction for15 year's,constantly bitching about how sick i was and how sick and tired i was of being sick and tired.I would get sober and a week later i would start using again,instantly planning another detox.I felt like i was supposed to suffer,i mocked the addiction as if i were winning the fight that i was obviously losing.I know of no human alive who has tried to "self destruct" hundreds of time's,yes no bullshit i detoxed hundreds of time's and felt an ignorant arrogance as if i were invincible.I was a stupid young cocky arrogant,hateful,asshole.This amazing lady,that's how i refer to my wife as "Lady"This woman opened her home and her heart to me with no prejudice and no judgement.I remember laying in bed and just talking for hour's about nothing,something,everything.We use to sit in our bedroom and play Nintendo64 "Golf"she kicked my ass in golf lol but the connection was simple and nothing like you see in the movie's but I had never felt such love in my life and i asked her half ass joking around after about 6 week's if she wanted to get married and she said "are you serious?"I replied yes because well i wasn't really joking when i asked but if she said no i could have played it off.I can't tell you how many times this beautiful lady took care of me while sick (detoxing) this entire blog idea was for me to document my road to recovery and i apologize in advance but i will type about my family very often at this stage of recovery because My soul mate is not by my side and even worse i worry her love for me has faded and i have to learn to deal with that if that indeed is the case and if it is i pray she finds a man who can give her everything emotionally that i could not(At the time)I think I can now but i may never get the chance to hold her face and look deep into her eye's and tell her she is my everything.My wife is a "pleaser"by nature.She will do anything for anyone at anytime because that's the heart she has.Her heart is contempt as long as everyone else's is taken care of.She will sacrifice her wants to deliver someone else's and i took advantage of that like a selfish,heartless asshole and now that i can totally see that damn do i feel dumb,the best thing ever in my life i took advantage of.How does that feel?It feels shameful,empty,heartless,cowardly,embarassing,ridiculous,pathetic,etc.So back to the nightmares,I try to sleep with peace in my heart and soul every night before I go to sleep i pray.I sleep with my clothes on,fully dressed shoe's and all because I'm scared i will receive a call while a sleep saying something happened to my wife,kid's,grandkids,etc and if that call ever comes i need to be able to make it to them in under 10 minutes so every night i stay prepared for immediate fight for your life type combat.No guns but i carry knives on each pocket just incase i have to fight through an army to get to them.I sleep for just under an hour and wake up and jump out of bed looking for my wife,it usually takes me about 5-8 seconds to realize that was a dream where i heard her scream for help..Every night I do this and i wake up with my heart racing and i would usually go to the gym and run 4 miles or so to release that combat rage i wake up with,but now i can't run as i wait on knee surgery so this dream wakes me up and once i realize it was just a dream i am so worked up i pace for hour's on end from one side of the house to the other the whole time asking myself "what have you done"?This nightly occurrence is terrifying and i struggle mightily with it.I never knew a person could feel so empty and lost but i do and i remember my wife telling me she felt that way year's ago and couldn't understand what she meant.Now i know,now i understand."How does it feel?"It feels like torture through love.I love you lady and i hope i can make you smile again someday.My emotions confuse me,i do not understand them,i do not know how to control them,i am only 6 month's sober so i pray in time i will adapt and i pray everyone who reads this holds their loved one's a little closer tonight and shows them how much they mean to you because waking up every night hearing your wife scream for help when she's not even there can really hurt,deep,and extreme.I will keep pushing forward and hopefully some day soon i can figure this sleep thing out without hearing screams now when i should have heard them while i was there.I'm sorry i hurt you lady i truly love you,though you will never read this as you have no clue about this blog i wrote this for you because i can't get you out of my mind
  18. True concern

    True concern Moderator


    If for no other reason but to be able to write like this once more I am a day or two away from going back to the sobriety path,the path I know I need,custom built for my needs for real,pure stability. I have not tried writing like this in some time because I have wrote enough about my struggle, I only want to write about the road,the process,the victory.Yes I have been here a million times before but after all I've lost I realize that's a minor part,the selfish part only recently have I thought about and considered what all my loved one's lost,each unique,each different but it's a fact they all lost something as I lost myself.My wife lost well not much after reading my life struggle but in there mixed with the bad were some really good time's as well,too damn many people affected to list all they lost when I gave up on me but I see now I should have been mature enough to leave before it got where it did,God's honest truth losing my family was the most painful experience of my life and I have lived in self pity for far to long.

    Without conviction a fight this long could never last,without hope and faith I could not continue to fight. -TRUE CONCERN-
  19. Onceaddicted77

    Onceaddicted77 Spam fighting Moderator & Realist Community Listener


    Good post @Joshstillclean I just had a epiphany too over these posts and yea it makes alot of sense. We gotta stop trying to conform to other peoples meaning of sober. It's what it means to you is what matters.

    For me it was getting off buprenorphine I had been on it for 8 plus years I was addicted and dependent. That was me getting sober, I did it for me and my wife. I felt like it was suppressing my emotions and it was to an extent. My main motivation for me getting off was my happiness and to be free from the binds.

    Well It worked for a month I had never felt closer to my wife I had the full spectrum of emotions which I guess had to be the bupe because I experienced rebound in a heightened state and I loved it. I felt alive

    It's a struggle for me because one side of me wants to feel and the other side dosnt. Because caring comes with consequences in the form of anxiety.
    Joshstillclean and True concern like this.
  20. True concern

    True concern Moderator

    Caring will make you type 90 different threads and thousands of comments,but it must make a difference in the lives of some I have a ton of likes which I assume could just be habit click,glad I don't have that addiction lol.......Fu*k my life is lonely and pathetic, I watch this site all fuckin day looking for anyone to chat with,I am just blah